Curse

Antares Ascending · Jun 12, 2009, 05:22 PM // 17:22

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I love the game as is. One thing that I didn't like on some games were the armors....just way tooo much. WOW armor just looked silly..to much!

I do have a major issue with the change with mouse click movement tho.

Recent thread on opinions on the mouse change:

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10380342

Sparda · Jun 12, 2009, 06:06 PM // 18:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antares Ascending

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I do have a major issue with the change with mouse click movement tho.

Recent thread on opinions on the mouse change:

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10380342

For the click to move issue i agree im not happy with that but just my opinion about it.
For the rest im looking forward to GW2 only for the Lore and the world they have made so far. They are chopping allot away for what we know now but i love to see more of the world of Tyria. The enviorments they created are just stunning.
As for the rest one big world as any other MMO dunno im like as it is Instance. I like it course it means that people can't annoy me with there Sh*t or grieve me with there ninja looting or PK.
And when im allone or with a well created team so when i screw up or we, we can't be helped. With persistence when you screw up you can call your friends and clean up your mess. As for Instance makes you use your head and go in well equipt so when you fail you are to blaim not the rest of the world.

Dae GW · Jun 12, 2009, 06:12 PM // 18:12

Quote:

everything felt rather balanced and you guys really seem on the ball with tweaking abilities that are out of line

Orly?

What about IWAY, they didnt even nerf it last month, while they did nerf balanced skills like WoH.

Dude, i dont think you have a clue what balanced means to be honest. The only time guild wars really was balanced, was 4 years ago when the game came out. Since they started making new campaigns and skills changes, the game became IMBA.

Gj izzy...

wetsparks · Jun 12, 2009, 07:38 PM // 19:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gun Pierson

There is no such thing as too many skills in a game like GW. More skills = more food for the brain. There are plenty of games out there that don't use the MTG model and if you want the perfect balance you should look into Starcraft and prolly Starcraft2.

Plenty of skills and only 8 to bring is a trade mark of GW. You shouldn't look at the rest of the market as there is no game out there like GW.

the game has 1200 skills I believe, the fact that it is balanced as much as it is is a miracle. They could cut those skills in half and probably have more to balance than any two mmos.

@dae gw
the game has never been "balanced." way to many skills with way to many combinations. I think you nostalgia has gotten the better of you when thinking back to what GW was like with just Prophecies. They do the best they can with an impossible situation. I love people like you though who think they know everything and could "balance" the game if given the opportunity.

BTW, the biggest plus to GW is that everyone plays on the same server and they don't have to take the servers down to update the game. Hope that tech stays around for GW2.

Shewmake · Jun 12, 2009, 07:47 PM // 19:47

You missed one pro-- Jeremy Soule's music!

Dae GW · Jun 12, 2009, 08:27 PM // 20:27

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I love people like you though who think they know everything and could "balance" the game if given the opportunity.

Did i ever say that i could do it, i just say that izzy fails.

Quote:

the biggest plus to GW is that everyone plays on the same server and

tbh, i think this is a con, too much lag in GW imo.

Lonesamurai · Jun 12, 2009, 08:33 PM // 20:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dae GW

tbh, i think this is a con, too much lag in GW imo.

but that IS the main point, its also not one server, theres just no barriers between them

The Great Al · Jun 12, 2009, 08:50 PM // 20:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Draele

I'm a long time Guild Wars player, as far back as the original beta. Since the game has come out I've played my fair share of other MMO-style games. For the most part, GW stacks up really quite well, and I'd like to touch on where I feel the game has done well, and not so well, if only to add my feedback to the pot for the developers of GW2.

-Pros-

Graphically, I absolutely adore Guild Wars. It's the perfect mix of realism and stylization, and I especially adore the glossy post-process effect that really gives the world something of a dream-like look. To put it comparatively: WoW and WAR are too cartoony, Vanguard and a handful others just look lame as they're trying to look TOO real. GW strikes a perfect balance between the two and I hope this feature stays. (Props on the Shiverpeaks, especially. What an awesome area)
Performance-wise GW is excellent. I've gone through three computers since GW initially launched, and even with my old PoS Compaq the game ran near flawlessly with little/no slowdown. You hit on some magic formula to make the game look great and still run well. Absolute thumbs up here.
Missions. One of the highlights of the game for sure. The scripted mission system really make you feel like you're in the middle of something so grand. The big battles, exposure to story elements, cutscenes, sense of urgency and the general vibe is top notch.
UI. Minimalistic and awesome. I love the default placement of the buttons, the very centered/symmetrical look of the overall screen, and how it's customizable with moving frames around without some 3rd party addon. You're presented simply with the information you need to see and nothing more. More screen real estate devoted to seeing what's on screen was an excellent decision.
PvP. I'll be honest I'm much more of an explorer/mission runner than a PvPer, but I've still done my fair share. Generally, everything felt rather balanced and you guys really seem on the ball with tweaking abilities that are out of line. Map design is generally really strong as well.
Abilities. I love the overall skill/attribute system. It creates a great system of trade-offs. Do you want to focus on 2 attributes? Or spread your points out a little wider and maybe go for 4? The skill limit, while initially fairly annoying, in the end makes for more interesting gameplay as it really puts the choice of how you want to play in your hands by allowing you to make your own build. Classes, likewise, are rather unique and you're presented with many interesting combinations.
Combat. GW is first and foremost a game about combat. I love how there are waves and waves of enemies to fight. When you run out you can simply re-run the mission, reset the explorable area, etc. While the game certainly has a story, and an economy, and all other things that make up a good online RPG, GW is first and foremost an action-RPG style of game. I like that and hope it stays.

-Cons-

Gear. Unfortunately the gear system in GW is really quite boring. Items feel more like cosmetic extras than statistically interesting boosts to your character's combat potential. Maybe have an item that reduces the refresh timer of Empathy by 5 seconds, or another that reduces the energy cost of Vampiric Gaze by 3, etc. Just add many more mods to the items. As it is the system is just really, really dull. I do have to give props in one area: the fact that you didn't include attributes in the traditional sense: str, dex, int, wix, charisma, etc. These are throwaway stats that really aren't as interesting either. Items that effect how you play, rather than simply offer a blanket boost to all/most of your abilities, are much more fun.
Responsiveness/control/lag. This is probably my biggest gripe with the game. Overall control response is much poorer compared to other games. Maybe this is a weakness of a non-subscription fee game where servers unfortunately can't be as quick as one might like. Or maybe it's a limitation with the current engine. Either way, I'm compelled to list this one as it particularly gets on my nerves.

Overall definitely more pros than cons. These are, of course, only my opinions so you might disagree. Either way, I hope they help a little bit.

I agree with all of your 'pro's. However, I disagree that Guild Wars is an 'action RPG'. To me, an action RPG is when you actually get to swing your weapon and actually have to aim your hits, aim your spells, etc. An action RPG lets you actually have to do blocks yourself, you can aim stuff at the ground instead of necessarily at an enemy, etc. Oblivion is an action-RPG, GW is more of a dice rolling RPG. I think it'd be awesome if GW was an action RPG but I highly doubt it will happen.

There are a few 'cons' that I would like to add, that, if they are fixed, would greatly improve GW2.

Cons of GW (along with what you already have).

1. Having separate 'chapters'.
This was a big mistake, IMO. Every extra game added to GW2 should be an expansion. Not one that is mandatory to buy, necessarily, but one that really adds on to the previous game. Time shouldn't have been spent developing new areas with <20 monsters, once everyone was at level 20 by the end of prophecies. Who had Prophecies without Factions, anyway? Especially with a much higher level cap, having separate chapters just doesn't make sense.

2. PvE 'skill over time'
In theory, this is nice. Practically, however, it doesn't work. I am NOT a fan of grinding, and the idea that a guy that spends hundreds of hours grinding will be more powerful than my character kind of sucks. That being said, there is so little skill involved with PvE that, contrary to what some people might think, I don't believe that there is any way to set yourself apart. If I've played the game for 3 years, 600 hours, I want my elementalist to have a better fireball than someone who just reached level 20.

'Skill over time' also means that there wasn't unique weapons and armor (outside of skins) that truly had rare statistical bonuses. 'Skill over time' has to be somewhat compromised in order to give characters more of a sense of uniqueness

3. Skill animations. Not a huge deal, but the skill animations are pretty bad.

Mordakai · Jun 12, 2009, 08:51 PM // 20:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dae GW

Did i ever say that i could do it, i just say that izzy fails.

I think the man is doing the best he can considering the circumstances.

There are just too many skills, even Mike O'Brien admits that.

Gun Pierson · Jun 12, 2009, 10:18 PM // 22:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by wetsparks

the game has 1200 skills I believe, the fact that it is balanced as much as it is is a miracle. They could cut those skills in half and probably have more to balance than any two mmos.

MTG has over 10 000. I agree though that it gets more complicated the more skills you have, especially with software.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mordakai

There are just too many skills, even Mike O'Brien admits that.

Ofcourse he admits that, he doesn't want to have a very big skill balance team and wants to keep things simple, it saves time and money. Everything has pros and cons, less skills is easier to balance, but it will have an effect on variety of builds and play styles.

Imagine the 'monk' class in GW2. Two 'attribute' lines, healing and protection with each 10 skills. Pretty dull imo, but maybe I'm wrong.

Lishy · Jun 12, 2009, 11:01 PM // 23:01

Jeremy Soule
You rock, dude!

Who can argue that GW has bad music? The music itself is awesome. My only complaint is that it is improperly used sometimes.

Willow O Whisper · Jun 13, 2009, 12:37 AM // 00:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gun Pierson

MTG has over 10 000. I agree though that it gets more complicated the more skills you have, especially with software.

Yea and magic is completely balanced *cough* Power nine *cough* Seriously i think a-net is doing a great job at fixing skill balance...my only complaint is when they start making non skill balance....-_-'.

Dark Saviour · Jun 13, 2009, 03:57 AM // 03:57

I'll preface this by saying that I know that my opinion will likely be unpopular, but I'd honestly prefer things be modelled similarly to what was done in Phantasy Star Online (Not BB, though)...

I actually got Guild Wars partially because I was told that it was "alot like PSO," though that turned out to be an extreme exaggeration...

However, I LOVED PSOs rare system (which, from what I'm told was similar to Diablo 2's). Each enemy dropped specific rares which had set attributes, unique appearances, and in most cases, distinct special attacks. This allowed me to play as a "rare collector", and essentially run off a checklist of predefined items which made the game immensely enjoyable to me... With GW, "rares" can have variable stats, are not particularly distinct from one another and don't typically have unique skins. When I'd heard the green, "unique" items were introduced, I was really excited, only to find out they're pretty much identical to other non-unique items you can get and don't even have unique appearances or bonuses...

I know that such items may be considered to complicate balance in PvP (especially if anything to the effect of a Heaven's Punisher or Lavis Cannon was included), so I say either simply restrict the equipment used in PvP to certain predefined items or nerf the bonuses to such a baseline. I'm sure a way to accomodate such items exists and I'd really like to be able to pursue a full "collection" of unique rares, so this is something I'd REALLY like to see in GW2 (and on that note, no limited time rares or contest-winner-only rares please... This... would kill me... <_<)

Another aspect of PSO I much preferred to GW was the teaming/instancing system... I really don't like having to get together a full group in town. I'd rather just start playing and let people join as they wish... With PSO, this was possible since you'd just create a "room" and get your own instance of the game which people could enter or leave at their discretion. Thus, you meet new people and chat as you play (rather than just standing around for an hour trying to find the guy that happens to have a build you like...) Unfortunately with the introduction of some of the titles, this could be abusable in GW, but had it been implemented at the start, that would have been a non-issue. However, GW2 has been stated to use a persistent world which makes this point moot with respect to it. However, I really hope that you will be able to "group" in the field should you so choose rather than keeping team-formation restricted to towns... :-/

I know, I know... What I want is more like "PSO2" than "GW2", but with what Sega's devolved into... yeah... So I'm desperately holding onto the glimmer of hope that ANet takes a turn more towards the style I love with GW2.

EDIT: Something else NON-PSO related I'd like to see from GW2: Better Presentation.

By this I mean everything from the storytelling to the pacing to the animations... Factions is the biggest offender in these respects having an incredibly disjointed and "splotchy" story and coming off extremely poorly in its cutscenes...
To elaborate on the latter part: Characters unnecessarily wielding the weapons in cutscenes, using the basic "emotes" rather than properly-designed animations, etc. It kinda detracts from the mood to see Shiro wandering around with his daggers drawn, have them suddenly disappear while he does the ridiculous "shoo" animation at the fortune teller, have them pop back into his hands, etc...

Gigashadow · Jun 13, 2009, 06:49 AM // 06:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gun Pierson

Imagine the 'monk' class in GW2. Two 'attribute' lines, healing and protection with each 10 skills. Pretty dull imo, but maybe I'm wrong.

This is what I'm a little worried about, as having a huge skill pool to make builds from is what made GW so fun for me. I doubt they'll dumb it down too much, as this is the one concept that really makes GW what it is. Maybe something like 1/2 of the # of Prophecies skills though. They indicated a skill might do different things depending on the context in which it is used.

I also hope that dual classing lets you actually feel like a dual classed character. The current system really forces you into specialization. Today it seems either you take one or maybe two utility skills from your secondary at a low (or zero) attribute investment, or you are exploiting your class's primary attribute and your entire bar is made up of only secondary skills.

If you had a separate attribute point pool for your primary and secondary class, then you would not feel like you were gimping yourself by investing in secondary skills.

Sir Seifus Halbred · Jun 13, 2009, 10:04 PM // 22:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antares Ascending

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I love the game as is. One thing that I didn't like on some games were the armors....just way tooo much. WOW armor just looked silly..to much!

What game(s) are you referring to? I don't understand your post.

The Great Al · Jun 13, 2009, 11:45 PM // 23:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gigashadow

This is what I'm a little worried about, as having a huge skill pool to make builds from is what made GW so fun for me. I doubt they'll dumb it down too much, as this is the one concept that really makes GW what it is. Maybe something like 1/2 of the # of Prophecies skills though. They indicated a skill might do different things depending on the context in which it is used.

I also hope that dual classing lets you actually feel like a dual classed character. The current system really forces you into specialization. Today it seems either you take one or maybe two utility skills from your secondary at a low (or zero) attribute investment, or you are exploiting your class's primary attribute and your entire bar is made up of only secondary skills.

If you had a separate attribute point pool for your primary and secondary class, then you would not feel like you were gimping yourself by investing in secondary skills.

I like having a lot of skills, but there were too many useless skills as well. There were elites that weren't even as good as non elite skills. I'd rather have less overall skills, but maybe be able to take more than 8 with me. Having a second profession didn't really matter because you could never fit more than 1 or 2 skills in the skillbar, unless you were running a special farming or running build.

Avarre · Jun 14, 2009, 05:56 AM // 05:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gun Pierson

MTG has over 10 000. I agree though that it gets more complicated the more skills you have, especially with software.

Competitive MTG play almost always uses a single block though, rather than every card ever made. GW tried to do that (Winter tourney, NF/Core) but was hobbled by the fact that the NF skills were ridiculous and huge amounts of viable setups were made proph/fac only.

If skills were decently assorted (ie: not removing hammer warriors from NF block by making crushingblow Proph), it would be a fairly useful idea - especially as it would mean new PvP players could just buy the current campaign and not be set back in the immediate season.